Eddie Edwards, Rental Housing Expert, Nutritional Team Builder (The Rental Housing Centers)

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Debe Maxwell, CRS
www.iCharlotteHomes.com | The Maxwell House Group | RE/MAX Executive | (704) 491-3310 - Charlotte, NC
Charlotte Homes for Sale - Charlotte Neighborhoods

The seller and the previous listing agent could have an agreement that the seller didn't share with you. As well, they could be communicating because they are friends outside of the real estate transaction.

If neither of the above exist, then she absoultely cannot access the property or communicate with the seller regarding a non-existent real estate transaction unless she goes through you. 

At least that's how it is here in NC & SC. 

Nov 23, 2017 01:26 PM
Rainmaker
933,361
Thomas J. Nelson, Realtor, ePRO, CRS, RCS-D
Big Block Realty 858.232.8722 - La Jolla, CA
& Host of Postcards From Success Podcast

I agree with Debe Maxwell, CRS and I also surmise you didn't ask enough clarifying questions before listing. You always vet out the previous agents' agreement with the seller when you are agent #2. I make sure it's dead and buried.

Nov 23, 2017 01:53 PM
Rainer
240,142
J.R. Schloemer, CRS
Kentucky Select Properties - Louisville, KY

Our holdover clause expires upon the relisting of the property. I think a call needs to be made to her broker.  I think it may be time to terminate your listing and let those two have each other 

Nov 23, 2017 08:02 PM
Rainmaker
3,137,431
Nina Hollander
Coldwell Banker Residential Brokerage - Charlotte, NC
Your Charlotte/Ballantyne/Waxhaw/Fort Mill Realtor

What Debe Maxwell, CRS said.

Nov 23, 2017 01:52 PM
Rainmaker
723,694
Candice A. Donofrio
Next Wave RE Investments LLC Bullhead City AZ Commercial RE Broker - Fort Mohave, AZ
928-201-4BHC (4242) call/text

This is actually a really great question. And we run into this on occasion especially with commercial properties that are being listed for lease w property management company and building listed for sale with another broker. In this case, however, it's no longer listed for sale. Right? Why? Ask the property owner. Do they still want to sell the house as well as rent it? Secure exclusive right to sell to go with the exclusive right to rent. Then, if the former listing agent brings a buyer, cooperate and do a deal.

Nov 23, 2017 01:34 PM
Rainmaker
4,493,688
Ron and Alexandra Seigel
Napa Consultants - Carpinteria, CA
Luxury Real Estate Branding, Marketing & Strategy

Follow what Debe Maxwell, CRS said.  A

Nov 23, 2017 01:27 PM
Rainmaker
3,364,826
Michael Jacobs
Pasadena, CA
Los Angeles Pasadena 818.516.4393

Maybe it's the trypothan, I'll come back later and review---or just move on..yeah movin' on is a good idea

Nov 23, 2017 05:13 PM
Ambassador
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Silvia Dukes PA, Broker Associate, CRS, CIPS, SRES
Tropic Shores Realty - Ich spreche Deutsch! - Spring Hill, FL
Florida Waterfront and Country Club Living

Have you addressed your concerns with the owner of the property?

Nov 23, 2017 05:01 PM
Rainmaker
774,082
Kasey & John Boles
Jon Gosche Real Estate, LLC - BoiseMeridianRealEstate.com - Boise, ID
Boise & Meridian, ID Ada/Canyon/Gem/Boise Counties

I am not really sure how it works in your area, or what your contract says. Honestly, I think this is a question best discussed with your broker. Happy Thanksgiving! -Kasey

Nov 23, 2017 03:45 PM
Rainmaker
5,428,437
Roy Kelley
Realty Group Referrals - Gaithersburg, MD

Both of you need to follow the terms of the written agreements.

Nov 23, 2017 03:41 PM
Rainmaker
5,042,458
Barbara Todaro
RE/MAX Executive Realty - Franklin, MA
Marketing Agent for The Todaro Team

what Debe Maxwell, CRS said....

Nov 23, 2017 03:32 PM
Ambassador
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Joe Pryor
The Virtual Real Estate Team - Oklahoma City, OK
REALTOR® - Oklahoma Investment Properties

I would think you have a broker you pay and that is who you should be having a conversation with.

Nov 23, 2017 02:49 PM
Rainmaker
1,022,944
Sam Shueh
(408) 425-1601 - San Jose, CA
mba, cdpe, reopro, pe

In our area, a mls must be delisted before one can list for rent or whatever.

Another way to control is put your Supralock box call the listing agent to go get lost. You can block his name on your lockbox also.

 

Nov 23, 2017 01:27 PM
Rainmaker
2,465,099
Richie Alan Naggar
people first...then business Ran Right Realty - Riverside, CA
agent & author

I understand the core principals of opportunity, making a buck and seizing the day but ethics says how not to go about this...I believe your explanation answers your own question. Go with that

Nov 23, 2017 01:13 PM
Rainmaker
750,320
Jeff Pearl
RE/MAX Distinctive / LIC in VA - Lovettsville, VA
Full Service Full Time Realtor

She could say that she is showing it to potential tenants. Maybe she doesn't do rentals, which is why owner called you to do rental listing? Here's it acceptable for one broker to have a sale listing and a different broker to have a rental lsiting on the same house at the same time. I would just focus on getting it rented.

Nov 24, 2017 03:08 AM
Rainmaker
3,053,541
Tony and Suzanne Marriott, Associate Brokers
Haven Express @ Keller Williams Arizona Realty - Scottsdale, AZ
Serving Scottsdale, Phoenix and Maricopa County AZ

In Arizona one agent can list for rent, while Seller can list with another agent for sale...

Nov 24, 2017 02:26 AM
Rainmaker
1,496,087
Inna Ivchenko
Barcode Properties - Encino, CA
Realtor® • Green • GRI • HAFA • PSC Calabasas CA

I would not guess, and just talked to both of them separately to understand what is going on. If your client seller is interested in possible sale of the property, I'd suggest to add it anywhere in writing. 

Nov 23, 2017 09:53 PM
Ambassador
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Jeff Dowler, CRS
Solutions Real Estate - Carlsbad, CA
The Southern California Relocation Dude

I thnk Debe Maxwell, CRS  has the answer

Nov 23, 2017 08:52 PM
Rainmaker
3,983,375
William Feela
WHISPERING PINES REALTY - North Branch, MN
Realtor, Whispering Pines Realty 651-674-5999 No.

I would get the help of your Broker.  Just hearing Broker and even the playing field a bit

Nov 23, 2017 08:13 PM
Ambassador
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Bob Crane
Woodland Management Service / Woodland Real Estate, Keller Williams Fox Cities - Stevens Point, WI
Forestland Experts! 715-204-9671

It is listed with you is it not?  Let them help you sell it. As far as communicating with your client you may want to put a stop to that.

But I really do not know the laws of your state so check with your broker for the real advice on this one.

 

Nov 23, 2017 07:55 PM
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Debbie Reynolds
Platinum Properties - Clarksville, TN
Your Dedicated Clarksville TN Real Estate Agent

If you have a contract to find a renter for the property, the Code of Ethics does not stop an agent from contacting your client for a different kind of service which in this case is selling the property. You may not be privy to his other relationship and agreement. 

Nov 23, 2017 06:30 PM
Rainmaker
2,801,051
Kathleen Daniels
KD Realty - 408.972.1822 - San Jose, CA
San Jose Homes for Sale-Probate & Trust Specialist

This needs to be discussed in detail with the owner of the home. Get the details ... it seems there is more to this than you are aware of.  Making assumptions can bite us in the back side. 

Nov 23, 2017 06:08 PM
Rainmaker
1,039,798
Dave Martin (703) 585-4687
Fairfax Realty - Fairfax, VA
Making Realty Dreams a Reality #WeWillGetYouHome

You want to check directly with your client before making guesses.

Nov 23, 2017 05:58 PM
Rainmaker
525,654
Dave Halpern
Keller Williams Realty Louisville East (502) 664-7827 - Louisville, KY
Louisville Short Sale Expert

 Somewhere is a "rule book." Could be your MLS bylaws or other formal local or state document.

Find the relevant rule. The agent with the best documentation wins.

Nov 23, 2017 04:21 PM
Ambassador
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Fred Griffin, on leave of absence from ActiveRain
Fred Griffin Real Estate - Tallahassee, FL
Licensed Florida Real Estate Broker

 Debe Maxwell, CRS and Ken Jones, SRES, ASA, SCGREA have given good advice.  Have you discussed this with your Seller?

Nov 23, 2017 02:55 PM
Rainmaker
1,170,174
Valeria Mola
SIB Realty - Miami, Sunny Isles Beach - Sunny Isles Beach, FL
305-607-0709 SIB Realty

Great answers are here

Sep 30, 2018 10:37 PM
Rainmaker
565,813
Nathan Gesner
American West Realty and Management - Cody, WY
Broker / Property Manager

It sounds like the Seller is giving the other agent access to the home to continue trying to find a buyer. They're using you to find a renter because the seller wants to have his cake and eat it, too.

You have to decide if you want to work with an owner that is not 100% honest with you and committed to renting the home.

Nov 24, 2017 07:35 AM
Rainmaker
1,083,060
Anthony Acosta - ALLATLANTACONDOS.COM
Harry Norman, REALTORS® - Atlanta, GA
Associate Broker

You have many answers here.  You may want to bring this information to your broker and find out what you can do in your area to address this matter.

Nov 24, 2017 05:57 AM
Rainmaker
705,051
Richard Bazinet /MBA, CRS, ABR
West USA Realty - Scottsdale, AZ
Phoenix Scottsdale. Sellers, Buyers & Relocations

You really need to talk to your client, and ask the question. Maybe explain the rules? And I would also call this agent and ask the same - so you know where you stand. Compare. The decide how to handle this.

BTW: A listing for rent does not equal a listing for sale - they are two different agreements.

Nov 24, 2017 05:46 AM
Rainmaker
768,733
Annette Lawrence , Palm Harbor, FL 727-420-4041
ReMax Realtec Group - Palm Harbor, FL
Making FLORIDA Real Estate EZ

That is the closest example of a sticky situation I've seen for awhile.

It addition to the 'access' issue that concerns you, their also exists an unseen interference dynamic that will have both agents taking shots at the other. Of course you have not disclosed the promise you made to pry this listing from the grasp of the friend of the owner.

You need to refer to your broker or attorney to determine if in your state two real estate contracts can exist simultaneously. In many states it is permissible for rental and sales to co-exist through different brokerages.

It is possible for you to take 'special' measures that deny the other agent access to this real estate without using their own resources. Such measures would be the utilization of a CBS code. If the other agent has in place their own access protocol, then they are a step ahead of you and very likely have staked claim to the premium location.

Take care NOT to spend your dollars on staging that make it more desirable for renting.

Your next meet-up with the owner should have the "Lov'n Spoonful' tune in the background.  Wait until you see the owners lips tuning in with the words "...gotta make up your mind. Say yes to one and leave the other behind. It's not often easy, not often kind.  BUT YOU GOTTA MAKE UP YOUR MIND!"

Your real issue is 'procurring cause' which has many interpretations and most often defaults to 'convienence.'  Most interpretations, in free market states, boil down to 'if you didn't write a contract, there is no cause. However, the reality is if one can afford an attorney, it can get messy.

How such things start are good predictors of how they will end. That means knowing exactly what the competing contract states.

Nov 24, 2017 05:43 AM
Rainmaker
3,306,867
Wayne Martin
Wayne M Martin - Chicago, IL
Real Estate Broker - Retired

Time to have your broker have a friendly conversation with her broker. 

Nov 24, 2017 05:37 AM
Rainmaker
4,797,528
Gabe Sanders
Real Estate of Florida specializing in Martin County Residential Homes, Condos and Land Sales - Stuart, FL
Stuart Florida Real Estate

I would talk to the seller and see what kind of arrangement they have.

Nov 24, 2017 04:54 AM
Rainmaker
657,951
Paul Antonelli
Antonelli Realty - Saint Cloud, FL
Broker Owner; Antonelli Realty

Debe Maxwell stated it correctly here. But does your sign on the home say RENT or SALE too? As a buyer that would make me concerned.

Nov 24, 2017 04:48 AM
Rainmaker
1,839,145
Michael J. Perry
KW Elite - Lancaster, PA
Lancaster, PA Relo Specialist

What does your Seller say about this ?

Nov 24, 2017 03:50 AM
Rainmaker
4,432,267
Gita Bantwal
RE/MAX Centre Realtors - Warwick, PA
REALTOR,ABR,CRS,SRES,GRI - Bucks County & Philadel

Good luck.

Nov 24, 2017 02:57 AM
Rainmaker
1,604,825
Evelina Tsigelnitskaya
SIB Realty - Sunny Isles Beach, FL
www.SIBRealty.org 305-931-6931

Have  no idea

Sep 30, 2018 10:37 PM
Rainmaker
4,109,739
Joan Cox
House to Home, Inc. - Denver Real Estate - 720-231-6373 - Denver, CO
Denver Real Estate - Selling One Home at a Time

This is a conflict, and sounds like you need to have a conversation with the owner.  Do they want to sell or rent it?

Nov 27, 2017 07:54 AM
Rainmaker
1,027,000
Susan Haughton
Long and Foster REALTORS (703) 470-4545 - Alexandria, VA
Susan & Mindy Team...Honesty. Integrity. Results.

Eddie Edwards  I am curious to know how this worked out and what your broker advised.  Please follow up when you can. 

Nov 25, 2017 07:02 AM
Rainer
230,518
Mike Rock
Complete Design - Granite Bay, CA
Granite Bay Luxury New Construction...For Less

i see tons of red flags. i might ask for the listing fee (or a %) if it sells before it rents

Nov 24, 2017 08:26 PM
Rainmaker
1,010,596
Kevin J. May
Florida Supreme Realty - Hobe Sound, FL
Serving the Treasure & Paradise Coasts of Florida

Eddie, you've been hired to rent it. Whatever relationship exists with the former listing agent and the owner is not your concern.

Nov 24, 2017 04:54 PM
Rainmaker
1,248,202
Ryan Huggins - Thousand Oaks, CA
https://HugginsHomes.com - Thousand Oaks, CA
Residential Real Estate and Investment Properties

My take, which is by no means legal advice:

The previous listing was a sale listing, the current one is a rental.  The protection clause ONLY applies if the house is still listed for sale.  Out here you have 24 hours (I believe) to provide a list of all parties to be covered under that clause to the new agent.

 

I'd ask the owner if they intend to sell the property or just lease it out.  If they have NO desire to sell, then I would call the former agent and have a VERY frank discussion with them.  If they do have a desire to sell, out here we have to complete a yes/no field in the MLS "Will consider sale" on lease listing (or will consider lease, if it's a for sale listing).  I'd change that to a "yes" and then market it for sale as well.  I'd also ask for a listing of persons covered by the 90 day clause from the prior agent (if your state does that).

Nov 24, 2017 09:38 AM
Rainmaker
738,540
Olga Simoncelli
Veritas Prime, LLC dba Veritas Prime Real Estate - New Fairfield, CT
CONSULTANT, Real Estate Services & Risk Management

I think your reading of the situation is correct, but there may be more than meets the eye. Most likely, the other agent is acting illlegally, but you need  to know what agreement she has with the owner e.g. she could be doing a series of "open" listings for each buyer. If you are listing the property as a rental, you must have some kind of relationship with the owner, so just ask what's going on.

Nov 24, 2017 07:33 AM
Rainmaker
1,379,417
Michael Setunsky
Woodbridge, VA
Your Commercial Real Estate Link to Northern VA

Eddie Edwards It appears the other agent has the owner's permission to do this. In this case the agent has a verbal agreement to show the property for sale. Your agency relationship and listing is strictly for renting the property and has no bearing on the situation.

Nov 24, 2017 06:29 AM
Rainmaker
3,022,152
Scott Godzyk
Godzyk Real Estate Services - Manchester, NH
One of the Manchester NH's area Leading Agents

First educate the seller and then remove her lock box and get back the key. It should come from the seller. The seller should know the liability and hw wrong this is. She can not be a listing agent then it expires and become a buyer agent without breaking the relationship she has based on her being a listing agent and knowing that sellers info, why they are selling and what they will take. If the seller wont get involved. 

Nov 24, 2017 06:25 AM